If the community on the Demigod official forums is better than on unofficial fansites, I would be amazed.  Official forums, in my experience, are very rarely better.  They're best for getting direct responses from developers / developer affiliates. 

My only problem with GR.org is that it's tougher to develop a strong and active community on there because Demigod will be just one small part of the entire website.  It's usually preferable to have a site (and forum) dedicated specifically to the game.

Hey, it's entirely possible those crazy APM's are being fueled by rampant amphetamine abuse! 

I used to paintball competitively.  Every weekend I was out practicing with my team at SC Village, playing alongside some really well known guys (Team Dynasty being the big one). We got pretty good and started getting involved in tournaments.  It went from a fun hobby to something completely different for me.  It became a real commitment.  It became more than just a game.  At that level way to often I found people taking themselves and their teams way to seriously.  Cheating was rampant, bad attitudes were everywhere.  Playing to win meant a lot of your good buddies have to sit on the sidelines, it ended up pitting friend against friend.  In the end, I got sick of the whole scene and bailed on it.  I'd rather go out in the woods with my buds and play like we did back in the day.

I guess my point is that you can enjoy competition without taking it to that next level of organized play.  It's a fine line, I'll admit, but it's something I know exists.  After a certain point, many people do take it way to seriously and it becomes more than a hobby.  I know this doesn't hold true for everyone either, but it does for many.

While it's true that at the highlest level of competition some people may take the game too seriously, a serious competitive scene is necessary for the continued interest of the playerbase in the game.  Sure, casuals who don't really care about watching replays or posting on forums and just play random matches or with friends won't really mind one way or another, but for the community to stay strong and cohesive and active, a competitive scene will be required.  It's not so much that all, or even most of the members of the community will be involved or will try to be involved in the higher levels of competition, but just the sense that there is more to the game than casual gameplay. 

Upper levels of competition provide entertaining replays, and the hope of rising through the ranks to become a well-known player.  They also give people more to talk about - discussion of balance and strategy is always much more prevalent and heated when the game is being taken to higher levels of competition.  The more casual the community is, the less they care about balance issues and strategy (because they aren't as much of a factor) and so the less they discuss about the game itself.

I agree. There is no point claiming Demigod to be an e-sport before it's even release and before the fact that the game could lose it's appeal way before there is any kind of balance required for truly competitive play.

I think everyone is jumping the gun a bit here. If you like the game so much then just wait until it's released and then enjoy it as much as you can for as long as you can instead of trying to predict a future for the game that is currently very uncertain.

I know what you mean, but I also believe that the community needs to have a direction and purpose in mind for the game in order for it to reach that point, or in other words, the game won't just develop a competitive "endgame" of its own accord, the community has to have a mindset towards making it that way and pushing the developers to steer it in that direction.

While the community is no doubt important, let's not kid ourselves - ultimately the game itself needs to play like an e-sports game to be a successful e-sports games.  While worms might have ended up in the tourney, it's still not considerred an e-sports game and is more of an aberration than a demonstration that any game can be an e-sports game.

I agree.  My main point, though, is that the game won't ever get changes for it to be more competitive and more like an "e-sport" unless the community makes it clear that a competitive "endgame" is a priority.  So far, throughout Beta, the community overall has seemed mostly content with the game and dissenting opinions, especially regarding significant changes to give the game more competitive depth, have been harshly criticized or shot down through irrational association with DotA. 

The community needs to change for the game to change.  If there's no push for the game to be shaped into an "e-sport," then it never will be.  Although the developers originally stated their intentions for the game to be a competitive staple, those intentions clearly changed over the course of the game's development.  That, I think, can likely be explained - at least in part - by the community reaction throughout Alpha and Beta.

What does "play like an e-sports game mean"? See I come from the Starcraft Community and probably 90% of them think that Starcraft is the only RTS suited for e-sport and that all other RTS are fail and need no skill to play, especially Warcraft III. If you ask a Warcraft III gamer he will say that Dota doesn't have any depth at all and is for noobs who are to bad for Warcraft III. Now Dota players come and tell me that Demigod had not enough depth (yet most of those guys suck horribly on Demigod - both when it comes to reaction and to understanding the game mechanics of Demigod). If I was to pick 5 preconditions you need for a e-sport title it is:

1) A as big as possible player base (which also means as low as possible system specs)

2) It must be interesting to watch and the audience must be able to understand what is going on and who is in advantage

3) usual Game Length must be between 15 and 30 minutes and not exceed 1 hour ever.

4) preferably rated "Teen", makes things a lot easier at least, especially in Europe.

5) "Difficult" enough to distinguish good from very good players and have a not too big influence of luck.

Some basic guidelines for an "e-sport" or competitive game:

1) easy to learn, extremely difficult to ever completely master

2) simple in concept, complex in details

3) fun no matter how skilled you are

4) easy to tell what's going on when watching

5) lots of structure / support for competition (ranking, statistics tracking, tournaments, matchmaking service)

6) well balanced

7) ideally the most competitive game is one where the better player always wins, so luck is not a significant factor

8) to be the best at the game means minimizing weaknesses and maximizing strengths; getting the most out of the units / resources you have available to you

9) emphasis on practiced skill and in-the-moment decision making rather than on knowledge and memorized strategies

(not in any particular order of importance)

"The Counterstrike of RTS"

Counter Strike doesn't waste time with logo videos when the game starts up. You can, infact, just launch DIRECTLY into a game from steam client in 4-5 seconds.

Demigod needs to cut out those logo videos so accessing a game, especially from Impulse's instant action is quick with as few interruptions as possible. Preferably none.

So does Demigod fit this criteria?

Right now my answer has to be: no. 

If you ask me "Could Demigod eventually fit this criteria?"

My answer is: Maybe; I wouldn't say it's really likely but it's certainly possible.

That said, these criteria are pretty high standards, but they are the standards I think apply for a game to really be a competitive "e-sport."  Even if Demigod doesn't reach these standards, it can still be a fun game.

That one is a pretty bad one though. One of the major reasons Starcraft is so much more fun to watch and play than Warcraft is that the  underdog has a chance to win - not by means of luck per se but with using cheesy builds and pulling off 1 really good move while in Warcraft the better player wins almost always.

I don't find Demigod that fun to watch. I've watched most of the videos on youtube but I just can't really get into them. The gameplay seems very repetetive. Maybe it's because I havn't played it yet, but as of now I would definitly rather watch a staracraft/warcraft match instead.

A player winning the way you described would make them the "better player" in that particular match, which is exactly what I mean.  In Starcraft, I would argue that the person who plays better almost always wins.